Buying a Zil 131

[Louittany]

Hello everyone,

I want to buy a Zil 131 (or an Ural 375D) and make a camper to travel across Europe.

I've done my research and found 2 companies that sell Russian vehicles: mortar investments (Czech Republic) and TDM military (Poland).

I'd like to know if any of you have dealt with them and if so if they are legit.

I've already sent an email to both of them and got an answer from mortar:

Asked them if they could do a conversion from petrol to diesel and what was the extent of the 'revision' they offered.
They simply said that the cost of conversion would never be covered by the savings in fuel and that the chassis were different. They also talked about how slow the truck would be with a diesel engine compared to a petrol one.

I really don't understand their answer as I've seen a lot of people actually converting their Zil to diesel. I've even seen a brochure from a Russian engine maker (Minsk motor plant) that offers special kits.

I'm waiting for the answer of TDM military (sent the email today).

I've also found a lot of Russian posts on avito.ru but I'd rather buy it from someone in the EU as it is easier to get it registered.

I have not been able to find Zils for sale in the UK, do any of you know a company selling?

Could any of you that owns a Zil 131 advise me on buying such a truck (and tell me that it is indeed possible to convert it to diesel)?

Best regards

Louis

[redneck]

There's one here that looks like a prime candidate for an engine conversion
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zil-131-Russ ... SwGdtco7aD
Just needs a box which shouldn't be too hard to get

[Potemkin]

Hi,

TDM are very easy and good to deal with but they may not have one available. However they do often have the rear boxes for sale.
I have had Zils and Urals both in petrol and diesel and there are benefits for both. Diesel conversions are expensive due to the labour involved making and adapting something not designed for the truck to begin with. If you can make do the swap yourself then its certainly worthwhile doing as the mpg gain is welcome.
The reason that people say diesels are slower is due to the fact that petrol engines run at higher revs than diesels and the gearbox and axles are designed to give certain speeds only. older diesels will not rev so high and so cannot get to the tops speeds that each gear was designed for. However what many people forget is that the russian V8 engine is not a high rev engine to begin with and a modernish diesel engine may rev to nearly the same. As an example the ivecco (pre tector) 4 and 6 cylinder engines rev about the same and when fitted give better torque and about the same top speed.
The cheapest option is to fit the original petrol engine with an option to run on LPG which is widely available all over Europe

[Louittany]

Good afternoon,

I got an email from mortar now offering me an Ural 4320 in mint condition for 19000€ ... This is way too expensive as my budget for the whole camper thing is around 20000€ MAX.

Thanks Potemkin for your useful message, it seems to me that TDM do have Zils available (around 5) for about 4000$ excluding VAT.

Thanks redneck for the ebay listing but that Zil seems to need a lot of work and I'd rather buy something already running well.

Do any of you know what is the price of the conversion to LPG for a Zil-131 ?

I've read the fuel consumption goes up by 20% when you convert to LPG, can someone confirm ?

Thanks for all everyone, I'll keep you updated.

[Abrs]

Hi. I've been running a Zil on LPG for a few years now, and yes I can confirm you do use more litres of LPG for the equivalent number of miles but it's still a good bit cheaper than petrol so it's well offset, performance is perhaps affected slightly but not really enough to notice. I think cost wise it would work out similar to what it would be if you had a diesel engine fitted. I don't mean to try and put you off here but I think you might want to try driving a Zil before buying one, it's not that they are bad trucks but you might find it a little bit more unwieldy than you imagine, in fairness they actually go well enough for an older vehicle but they are just a little awkward to manoeuvre and noisy as hell plus a tad bumpy, should also mention visibility is not great compared with a COE design, they're all things you can live with but there are obviously vehicles better suited for the intended purpose, but the Zil certainly has the fun factor. Good luck

[portamurda1]

There's one here that looks like a prime candidate for an engine conversion
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zil-131-Russ ... SwGdtco7aD
Just needs a box which shouldn't be too hard to get

That’s is literally on my doorstep
The original seller (after USSR obviously) had two of these, both with bowsers on, but we’re just left wehn the old guy got too worn to do much else with them

[Louittany]

Hi Abrs, thanks for your message. Can I ask you what did you spend converting your Zil to LPG ?
Do you have any examples of trucks better suited for my purpose ?

Also, do any of you know workshops where I could get a Zil converted to diesel/LPG ? I really don't have the skills for heavy work like this.

Thanks in advance for your very useful informations.

By the way, the ebay listing is now over 5000 GBP !!

[Rob Reznik]

There's one here that looks like a prime candidate for an engine conversion
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zil-131-Russ ... SwGdtco7aD
Just needs a box which shouldn't be too hard to get

That's a fair amount of money for something that could still have major engine issues

[portamurda1]

There's one here that looks like a prime candidate for an engine conversion
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zil-131-Russ ... SwGdtco7aD
Just needs a box which shouldn't be too hard to get

That's a fair amount of money for something that could still have major engine issues

I know it’s had all new gaskets, but dunno about hoses
Same old about worth, as much as someone will pay

[redneck]

Wow £5275 about £3k more than i expected

[ChrisClemson]

Hi Louittany!

Our ZIL 131 was converted to a Cummins B 6L diesel engine and Eaton 6 speed gearbox by the clever previous owner.
This means it has lost the PTO and Hi/Lo gear selection, but 2nd gear is still pretty low (I was told not to use 1st!).
It also means it is more economical to drive.
The previous owner said it was worth it as the original 7.5L petrol did about 140BHP, and the Cummins does 190.
Filling the tank (at Costco) when it was nearly empty cost ~£130 about 6 months ago, and that will get you ~200miles, although i've never done a proper scientific measurement.

It can do 50mph on a flat road no problem, but not much more.
I did try overtaking up a hill once around that speed and I could see the engine temperature getting hotter, so I backed off.

I guess the question is, now that everywhere is trying to ban diesel vehicles, does staying with petrol make more sense if you are going to urban environments, or because they are so inefficient, we'll be screwed anyway?

[Louittany]

Hi ChrisClemson,

Filling the tank (at Costco) when it was nearly empty cost ~£130 about 6 months ago, and that will get you ~200miles, although i've never done a proper scientific measurement.

If my math is right that's about 9MPG or 32L/100Kmh, I thought diesel converted Zils did around 20L/100Kmh ? If this is the kind of consumption I'm gonna get converting to diesel I'd rather convert to LPG ...
A mechanic is supposed to call me back about him possibly doing a diesel/LPG conversion.

Got an email from Mortar this afternoon saying they can convert a zil to LPG but aren't certified and there's no warranty on the work ... Plus I would need to disassemble everything before registering it.

This the price they are asking for a really nice Zil 131 and Ural 375d (radio cabin) :

ZIL:

chassis avant rénovation 5000€
cellule 1500€
painture 1200€révision téchnique1200€

engine electrics all new
engine new gaskets, hoses where necessary
new brake hoses
brakes repaired
all electrics working
all gauges working
fuel system repaired
air system repaired, CTIS disconnected


immatriculation véhicule ancien tcheque 500€

URAL:

chassis avant rénovation 6500€
cellule 1500€
painture 1200€
révision téchnique1200€

engine electrics all new
engine new gaskets, hoses where necessary
new brake hoses
brakes repaired
all electrics working
all gauges working
fuel system repaired
air system repaired, CTIS disconnected

Plus 1700€ for delivery.

Still no answer from TDM military.

Can anyone explain to me why the CTIS would be disconnected ?

Thanks

[Potemkin]

In some countries CTIS is regarded as military only and it has to be removed. I am sure Germany is this way and possibly the Czech republic too.

[Abrs]

Hi Abrs, thanks for your message. Can I ask you what did you spend converting your Zil to LPG ?
Do you have any examples of trucks better suited for my purpose ?

Also, do any of you know workshops where I could get a Zil converted to diesel/LPG ? I really don't have the skills for heavy work like this.

I'm not sure now exactly how much I spent in all doing the conversion as it was a few years ago now, probably would have some change out of £600 I would think, but I did it myself so there was no labour charge involved, I would think you could times it by three or more if you were paying for it to be done in a workshop.

With the parts I've used it works out as follows:
OMVL R90E Vaporiser @ £110
Blos LPG mixer @ £120
2X 120 litre LPG tanks incl mounts @ £120 ea
Piping,unions clips etc about £50

And there could be other bits n' bobs I've forgotten about but that should give you a ball park figure to work with.

As for more suitable vehicles there are many, but basically anything that is already a diesel and ideally just 4x4, there's little point dragging around an extra axle for the weight you're likely to be carrying as a camper. TBH something like the little daf 45's are ideal, or even a Bedford TM 4x4, and of course there are always MAN, Iveco, Renault ect etc. All depends on budget really, but don't forget to factor in as many of the other costs as you can think of, some options might not seem quite so appealing afterwards.

[ChrisClemson]

Hi ChrisClemson,

Filling the tank (at Costco) when it was nearly empty cost ~£130 about 6 months ago, and that will get you ~200miles, although i've never done a proper scientific measurement.

If my math is right that's about 9MPG or 32L/100Kmh, I thought diesel converted Zils did around 20L/100Kmh ? If this is the kind of consumption I'm gonna get converting to diesel I'd rather convert to LPG ...
A mechanic is supposed to call me back about him possibly doing a diesel/LPG conversion.

Well, the previous owner said ~10-12mpg, and I think I'm getting about that, just erring on the side of pessimism with my calculations
20mpg?? I wish!! maybe if it was empty, but mine's got tonnes of radio equipment inside.